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Posts by under the radar

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  35

  I'm new here

  by Diamonds in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i stumbled across this website a few months back and have often read the topics posted but this is the first time that i've posted anything myself.. all my family are jws - i got baptized when i was 17 but started to fade when i was about 20 and finally left at 22 when i managed to escape to university and move away from home.

  ten years on and i am still out of the org but never disfellowshipped (although i would have been if they'd have known what i've been up to!).

  the relationship with my family is not great - i get on with some members better than others.

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  under the radar

  Oops! Sorry, Diamonds. My mistake. I do look forward to hearing more from you. Thanks for introducing yourself.
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  35

  I'm new here

  by Diamonds in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i stumbled across this website a few months back and have often read the topics posted but this is the first time that i've posted anything myself.. all my family are jws - i got baptized when i was 17 but started to fade when i was about 20 and finally left at 22 when i managed to escape to university and move away from home.

  ten years on and i am still out of the org but never disfellowshipped (although i would have been if they'd have known what i've been up to!).

  the relationship with my family is not great - i get on with some members better than others.

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  under the radar

  Welcome Diamonds!

  Congratulations on breaking free from the chains of the Watchtower. That's very hard for most to do, and can take decades. So happy you got out while you still have most of your life ahead of you. Enjoy your freedom!

  When you have time, would you consider posting a copy of your class paper on cults for us all to read? I'm sure it would make for very interesting reading. Your perspective of being raised in a cult, realizing the trap you were in, and then freeing yourself from it only adds power to your words. It can be very therapeutic for others who had similar experiences to see how you dealt with everything. It shows them that freedom of thought is an achievable goal after all, and a worthy one.

  Again, welcome aboard. Looking forward to hearing from you again.

  Regards,

  Radar
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  33

  Dating a JW :-(

  by MIADanny in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i have been dating a jw for 2 years now and everything has been going great other than the fact that she is in a cult.

  she at first tried to convince me to join but she quickly realized i wasnt believer.

  in this age of information i just dont see how so many people can fall victim to this religion.

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  under the radar

  Hi Danny,

  The problem is that she may be willing to "break the rules" now in order to date you, and may even seem willing to leave the Truth™ to be with you, BUT there is at least an even chance that later she will want or be pressured by family or others to "come back." There would be unrelenting coercion and emotional blackmail to convince you to join her. If you don't, the marriage (and she can't be with you openly unless you do get married) will be under enormous stress. And if there happens to be children involved by that time, multiply that by at least two.

  Being raised a Witness seeps down into one's soul, and it's extremely difficult to completely extricate oneself from that cult mentality. Many "go astray" for awhile, but family pressure or guilt feelings eventually drive a certain percentage of them to return to what they view as "the Truth." That could easily leave you "holding the bag."

  Be gentle, be kind, but be firm and RUN from this situation as if your life depended on it. Your long term happiness DOES.

  Just my two cents worth,

  Radar
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  63

  Judical Committee- FUBAR decisions

  by Think About It in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i had posted this as part of another thread, but thought it might make a good separate thread.

  here's a jc fubar decision that i experienced.. i dealt with a brother who threatened to kill his family, my family, and then himself.

  this guys' secret sins were becoming manifest and as an elder some things came to my attention, including wife abuse and according to her, allegations of possible misconduct with the young daughter.

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  under the radar

  Hey Wildflower! In WWII, FUBAR mean "Fouled Up Beyond All Recognition." SNAFU was more a Navy term that meant "Situation Normal - All Fouled Up."

  Some insist on substituting another "F" word for "Fouled" but either way, you get the point.
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  4

  Advise on housing contract

  by acolytes in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i would value your opinions on how best to handle a dilema i have with a rental contract i signed.. 1-a year ago i agreed to let out a property i owned to a tennent.

  i spoke to the council and they said i was responsible for the water and sewage and so i areed to pay it.

  (would i failed to understand that it was my responsibility to pay the council but i was entiltled to ask the tennent tp pay me these monies.. 2-i also failed to take into consideration the basement , landing and hallways in working out the rent which is based on the kvm size of the house.. therefore on point 2 alone he is paying me 25% less a month than the correct monthly rental-.

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  under the radar

  I know it's none of my business, but since you asked...

  It appears that the mistakes in deciding what rent to charge were all your own. The renter signed the lease in good faith and you were happy with it at the time. It doesn't seem fair to change the terms now just because you have discovered you could or should have charged more. That said, there would seem to be nothing wrong with renegotiating the terms at the end of the initial lease. If it was open ended (no definite ending), then maybe you could notify the renter that you will keep things as originally agreed for some period (say, one year), but that after then the rent will need to be adjusted. If he wants to stay in the house, and you like having him as a renter, there should be no problem working out something satisfactory to both of you. Good luck!
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  23

  I really need some help

  by KICKED OUT in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i am an ex jw and happy.

  my sister is an ultra jw married to an elder.

  my non jw grandfather just past away and my sister has said for the last 15 years that she wanted nothing to do with that side of my family including me and especially my grandfather.

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  under the radar

  Wow! So let me get this straight... There actually IS a will (albeit changed several times), but you and your grandfather's other caregivers have taken it on yourselves to say there was NO will. If this is correct, and I sure hope it isn't, you all could be charged with conspiracy to commit fraud and probably several other crimes. Believe me, you want no part of this. PLEASE reconsider and announce to one and all that you have found our grandfather's will after all. You will save yourself a world of hurt.

  I completely understand why you don't believe your sister deserves a share in the inheritance. And your grandfather may have left his money or divided his estate in other ways you don't think is fair. You have every right to be upset. My aunt is leaving a substantial portion of her portfolio to the Society, which I believe is a total waste. If I could legally and morally stop that from happening, I would. But since she left that portion of her account to them as POD (payable on death), there is NOTHING I can do, even if I was the executor (which I am not). The real point, though, is that it is HER money and she can distribute it as she sees fit, whether I think it's fair or appropriate or not. If your grandfather was in his right mind when he made the latest changes, then you have a legal and moral duty to just accept it as it is. I know it burns like fire, but that's the way it is.

  The other posters are exactly right. Your sister will undoubtedly view this windfall as a "blessing from Jehovah," and use these "unrighteous riches" to "advance the Kingdom." Yeah, I know, disgusting and self-serving... but I can assure you that IS what will happen. So for your own peace of mind, try to get over the injustice of it all and get on with your life. If you and the others continue to deny that there was a will, and it eventually surfaces, there will be hell to pay. And if it can be proven that you deliberately hid knowledge of its existence, you could be in a LOT of trouble. Just think about it, OK? Stuff like this ALWAYS comes out. Eventually, someone ALWAYS talks. It'll be like a sword hanging over your head from now on.

  All that said, you and the others are to be commended on taking care of your grandfather. I know it must have taken a lot out of you. But you can hold your head high and know you did the right thing. And whatever you get from your grandfather's estate, you can enjoy it with a clean conscience. Meanwhile, please accept my condolences for the loss of your grandfather. I just lost a favorite uncle, and three other close relatives are in the short rows. Nothing makes losing a loved one any easier, but squabbling over money just makes it worse.

  Radar
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  53

  My Dad died

  by aquagirl in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  my dad,an elder for 25plus years,concentration camp survivor,the works,died in a few weeks ago.i am df'd but have been the only one who helps him and my mum.my jw sister couldnt give a rats ass about them.i was at my mom and dads house after he died,helping my mom with everyting,hell,id been there for 2 months because i was afraid to leave them alone.i knew my dad wasnt feeling well.guess he was worse than i realized.he died.the witnesses came in droves.small kitchen.im sitting at the table.they not only didnt speak to me,but they didnt even acknowledge that i was in the room,about day 3,i stopped answering the door..one "lady" called.sister carol.when i answered the phone she hesitated and said",now you know,i caint tawk to yew"{strong southern accent.ala elie may clampett}"you orta let cher mawma ainser the phone.

  "i told her to bite me and hung up on her...same here,when we got back home.i hate these people with the fury of a thousand suns,but for some reason,i am now in possession of some great elders notes.been laying low,but im going to start posting the juicy stuff.just cause itd be nice for calvin to know that he was seen "dancing recklessly" at a wedding and that sister renee was being councied for her weight and still insisted on gaining more.also that sister e wasnt giving her husband his "due"..{yik}and that certain concetration camp survivors were being coerced into saying that they were jw's at the time of incarceration.but one wouldnt.my dad refused to play their game,and as a result he was asked to step down as an elder at age of 80.that and that he refused to shun me.his notes have been very enlightening..nice folks thise jw's,no?

  they were so mean to my dad, he really believed this crap,and tried to do the right thing.but because he wouldnt dance their way,and turn me,his favorite person{and he was mine|into the cold they treated him badly and mocked him and even his accent.i hate them.really.any ideas?the local elder here,just asked my mom about her financial situation...grrrrrrrrrrrrr.

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  under the radar

  aquagirl,

  I am sorry to hear about your dad. We don't know each other, but please accept my sincere condolences. Your dad sounds like a wonderful person who stood up for what he felt was right regardless of the consequences. We need far more of his kind in the world, instead of fewer and fewer. The world is a lesser place with his passing.

  I can sympathize with your loss. Just last week, I lost my 93 year old uncle. His wife (late 80's), another 95 year old aunt, and my 85 year old Dad are all in hospitals on borrowed time even as we speak.

  I can also empathize somewhat with your resentment of how some of the holier-than-thou Witnesses are treating you. Even though I am not officially disfellowshipped or even disassociated, some in my family treat me as if I was. I am not being treated nearly as badly as you are, but I feel for you anyway. Like I told a family member who decided to institute her own private version of shunning me, "If you think that's going to make me want to come back, it's entirely the wrong approach. Feels more like emotional blackmail." I think they drive more people away forever with this callous mistreatment than they ever "shock into repentance." Talk about counterproductive...

  Anyway, besides offering my condolences, the main reason I wanted to post this was to reiterate the warning others have already posted. If the elders are already sniffing about, inquiring about your mother's "financial situation," it bodes no good. If there's any insurance or sizable assets involved, they'll probably suggest that she will at least a good part of it to the Society, or better yet, donate the bulk of it now in return for a monthly stipend for the "rest of her life." Of course, when she passes away, the Society keeps the balance. Ka-ching! How callous and conniving! Another ploy they use is to suggest you conditionally donate all you can now, but you can "get it back" in case of need. Of course, they don't explain that getting any of it back takes time and much paperwork. You can't just call in and request a check.

  One way to prevent these vultures from "robbing" your mother is for you to convince her to sign NOTHING financial without consulting you first. Better yet, ask her to grant you a Financial Power of Attorney, allowing you to manage her financial affairs if she is unable to do so. There might be other things you can do to protect your mother's assets from these blood-suckers, like having her list you as the POD (payable on death) beneficiary on any of her bank or investment accounts. That wouldn't be giving you access to these accounts now, but upon her death, they would automatically and immediately become yours to do with as you wish. Not subject to probate and certain taxes, and certainly not subject to the claims of anyone saying, "But Sister Do-good promised..."

  Thank you so much for sharing your feelings about your father and what a stand-up guy he was. And please do post as many of those "elders' notes" you can. They make very interesting reading!

  Again, I am very sorry for your loss. May you find the peace your father would want you to have, and that you so richly deserve.

  Radar
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  31

  Bible student with 8 kids turns down marriage proposal?

  by QuestioningEverything in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a woman who is studying/attending the kh where my mom goes has 8 kids.

  the oldest is 15y and the baby is only 7 weeks old.

  after studying for some time, she decided it would be morally right for her and the kids father to get married.

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  under the radar

  For what it's worth, I completely agree with garyneal's comment. If people knew they would be held responsible for providing for their own children, maybe they would be a little more careful about strewing their DNA around the landscape so willy-nilly. I believe birth control should be easily and plentifully available to all, and its use should be encouraged and promoted. The government should get out of the welfare business and let local charities and family members take up the slack.

  Benjamin Franklin was always opposed to establishing any kind of government dole because he feared it would create "a dependency." History has shown he was absolutely right. We've all read of families with multiple generations of welfare recipients who keep popping out more babies because they don't have to worry about feeding or clothing them. The rest of us have to! Generally speaking, it's the most ignorant uneducated crime-prone slackers of the community who abuse welfare the most.

  Public assistance can be a wonderful thing when it's used as originally intended... as a temporary stop-gap "emergency" measure to help those in trouble due to no fault of their own get back on their feet. There's absolutely nothing wrong with accepting welfare as a last resort when it's needed to help one survive life's little surprises and one tries to get off it as soon as possible. But no one should feel "entitled" to intentionally maneuver their circumstances to qualify for welfare and stay on it indefinitely. One egregious example would be the polygamous "outlaw" Mormons who take pride in "bleeding the beast" by having as many children as they can so they can suck more and more off the welfare system. That's disgusting and shouldn't be allowed. Eventually, there will have to be a crackdown on those who intentionally abuse the public's generosity and compassion.

  There should be a social stigma attached to being on welfare intentionally, by one's own design, or staying on it one second longer than necessary. Personal responsibility and self reliance should be encouraged and rewarded.

  Of course, we don't know if the woman this thread is about will wind up on welfare. But the principle stands: NO ONE should be allowed to create their own dependency for their own purposes. "Have all the kids you want, but don't expect me to feed them."
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  31

  Bible student with 8 kids turns down marriage proposal?

  by QuestioningEverything in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a woman who is studying/attending the kh where my mom goes has 8 kids.

  the oldest is 15y and the baby is only 7 weeks old.

  after studying for some time, she decided it would be morally right for her and the kids father to get married.

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  under the radar

  That's got to be one of the craziest things I've ever heard! And after growing up as a Witness™, that's saying a lot.

  I have to think that in most congregations, she would have been encouraged to marry the man, if only to remove the stigma of illegitimacy from her kids. And of course, if he was supporting her and helping her get the kids to the meetings, so much the better. I wonder whose idiotic idea it was to remove a "stumbling block" before any problems ever arose. Hmmm....

  Regardless of her reasons, I believe she should be absolutely prohibited from receiving ANY kind of public assistance (welfare, child care, etc.) for those kids. She's intentionally throwing away the only help and support she's truly entitled to. Kudos to the man if he still wants to support her and the kids, but I wouldn't blame him for only doing the minimum the law requires. She appears to have rejected him solely on the grounds of his not accepting HER new beliefs for himself. She is putting the kids at risk, depriving them of an apparently loving father, and disrupting their lives... all in the name of (ugh!) religion! Such nonsense. Maybe if she now had to support those kids all on her own, without any outside assistance at all, she would wake up and see how utterly stupid her actions were. Hopefully, maybe someone with a smidgeon of good sense in the congregation will nudge her to reconsider before it's too late.

  People can have all the kids they want, but I (and all the other taxpayers) should NOT be on the hook to feed, clothe, (attempt to) educate, and otherwise support them. That's the parents' job. Abortion is a very touchy subject, but I do believe that birth control in all its many forms should be freely and easily available to all. And if people knew for a certainty that any kids they had would be THEIR responsibility, not anyone else's, it would go a long way towards cutting back on the cavalier way some pop out babies with no concern for how they're going to feed them and take care of them. I know personal responsibility has pretty much gone out the window, but I am disgusted with people who repeatedly have children that others have to care for. And I'm definitely including irresponsible fathers in this, too. I say, "If you can't feed 'em, don't breed 'em."
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  79

  Finished Ex-Jehovah's Witness Survey (Please fill out for help with project)...

  by Tuesday in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hey everyone!.

  ) did you feel the religion was a cult before leaving?:.

  ) do you feel the religion is a cult now after leaving?:.

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  under the radar

  Ex-Jehovah's Witness Survey

  General

  A.) Name: Mark

  B.) Gender: Male

  C.) Age: 56-60

  Questions:

  1.) How were you introduced to Jehovah's Witnesses: Parents/Grandparents/Relatives were in before you were born and taught you

  2.) How did you leave the religion: Stopped attending all at once

  3.) What Age did you leave? 45-50

  4.) Were you Baptized? Yes

  5.) What General reason did you leave the religion: Didn't believe the teachings, not allowed to question the teachings, disagreed with stance on social issues, didn't agree with things said in the magazines or on the platform.

  6.) How did you feel about the doctrine before leaving: Believed there were more things wrong than right

  7.) Did your feelings about the doctrine effect the way you left? Yes

  8.) If you were disfellowshipped for sin, did your feelings on the doctrine effect you sinning in the first place? N/A

  9.) Did you feel the religion was a cult before leaving? I saw many similarities between the religion and a cult

  10.) Did you research the religion's teachings after leaving? Yes

  11.) What are your feelings on the doctrine of the religion since leaving? The religion has a problem with nearly every teaching

  12.) How do you feel about the organization since leaving? They are no different than any other religion they have good and bad

  13.) How do you feel about the people since leaving?: They are good people with a few bad apples

  14.) Do you feel the religion is a cult now after leaving?: They have most of the qualities of a cult

  15.) What is your opinion on the intelligence of those still in the Organization? : They're intelligent but purposely deny facts for their religion

  16.) Are you happier now that you're gone? I think I'm much happier now that I'm gone

  17.) Do you feel that other than the fact you left the Jehovah's Witnesses that they would agree with how you live your life? I do a few things they would not agree with

  18.) If a Jehovah's Witness approaches you to discuss their religion you're more than likely do the following: Tell them I was raised a Jehovah's Witness and feel they're wrong

  19.) Would you consider returning? When hell freezes over

  20.) How do you feel about discussing your time as a Jehovah's Witness?: It's part of me I'll discuss it if it comes up